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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
People get screwed by the Rep party, so they try the Dem party. The Dem party proves to be corrupt, so back they go with high hopes from the Rep party. And round and round we goooo...

It seems we are on an endless cycle or more appropriately, in a corrupt political vortex that is sending America down the drain! Seems to be exactly as the The Obama Deception HQ Full length version on YouTube portrays.

Do you think our current sytem is the best we can come up with? Or do you see another totally different political direction the US of A may be headed in?

PS...

The YT vid is long. It is a full length version of the DVD that is sold at Alex Jone's website. For those inclined, it may be worth watching or even listening to while you work in the house.

Let me sum the video up for those short on time.

Despite the Obama title, it is not so much about blasting Obama. It claims that no matter who we get, Rep or Dem, they are hand picked to get in by the powerful rich bankers that really run our country and will soon be running the world. It claims the US prez is only a figurehead under the thumb of the rich and powerful.

Thanks.
 

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First, what is this country, what should we be? ever wounder why when we say the pledge of allegiance we are pledging allegiance to the Republic of USA not a democracy? Did you know the word Democracy isn't in the constitution.

This country was founded as a Republic the founding fathers never intended for us to be a Democracy infact they feard a democracy. There's lots of confusion as to what a Republic and a Democracy is, even in encyclopedia rather vague leading one to the conclusion that they are basically the same...the are NOT the same. The simple explanation of our Republic is a weak federal government sub servant to a stronger state government that is weaker and subservient to local government that is regulated by citizens. The idea that the most restrictive laws & power to enact them are kept close to citizens not thousands of miles away controlled politicians and for sale to or by special interest lobby . The feds where never intended to hand down laws, new taxes and regulations unless those laws pertained to interstate commerce and international trade. slowly over the last 200 years the fed's have chipped away at our Republic adding a little law here and there adding another law a little tax and more regulation until we where twisted into a democracy.

History has shown that democracies fail from corruption, theft ... Rome is a perfect example, look at what's going on in this country today! don't take my word here's a couple quotes from people that created this country



"A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine. "
Thomas Jefferson


"Democracy... while it lasts is more bloody than either aristocracy or monarchy. Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There is never a democracy that did not commit suicide."
John Adams



Re-read Adams quote thats where we are headed!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Well spoken post.

Do you things would be different if people were actually included in the political decisions. Such as put ObamaCare to a national vote, etc, etc. Instead of electing politicians that just do as they please?
 

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They had good reason to fear it, look at what we have today. We all know where it's headed, i don't want to see it either but i fear they knew way to much, of what they were talking about. Maybe if taught true history in school we would not be in this mess.
 

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We are definately a constitutional republic that has been twisted. Our future is in the 7000 year plan laid out by God in the Bible, The books of Daniel and Ezekial give me insight to the future and Revelations tells me what and how things will happen. There are also lesser prophits who have had insite, you can learn about them on the History Channel. Obama, is definately a pawn, and probably an instrument of the Fed. Unfortunately the Fed has established more control over our society than it should have, but to me this is all in fulfillment of the scriptures. In the end as man tries to/become more God like, I know God is still in control and his ultimate will will be carried out. I am just down here prepping for a less troubled future, until the last trumpet sounds and I am out of here!
 

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Well spoken post.

Do you things would be different if people were actually included in the political decisions. Such as put ObamaCare to a national vote, etc, etc. Instead of electing politicians that just do as they please?
NO, i don't....the health care issue is likely too complex for most citizens and compounded by special interests agendas not to mention the way media spins things. IMO, less government is the answer not more. the involvement of citizens should be on a local level where the power should be NOT in Washington DC

the idea of a utopian society is a big mistake it doesn't exist in what we have today or under a true Republic all we can really hope for is freedom. when people talk about freedom it's often the sacrifice on a battle field but the price of freedom is paid in the risks of a free society crimes committed with guns or abortion these are the price for freedom limit these then where does it end ..smoking, drinking, driving your car?

Thats why i like this forum a group of people doing for themselves, planning being responsible working to better your situation for the future ...gee, what a novel idea
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
NO, i don't....the health care issue is likely too complex for most citizens and compounded by special interests agendas not to mention the way media spins things. IMO, less government is the answer not more. the involvement of citizens should be on a local level where the power should be NOT in Washington DC

the idea of a utopian society is a big mistake it doesn't exist in what we have today or under a true Republic all we can really hope for is freedom. when people talk about freedom it's often the sacrifice on a battle field but the price of freedom is paid in the risks of a free society crimes committed with guns or abortion these are the price for freedom limit these then where does it end ..smoking, drinking, driving your car?

Thats why i like this forum a group of people doing for themselves, planning being responsible working to better your situation for the future ...gee, what a novel idea
So, you don't wish to have any national votes on controversial issues handed over to the public? You wish to keep the lying, corrupt politicians in FULL control?

I agree with lots of what you said otherwise. And while the US had all these same issue in politics back in the day. The politicians were either was less corrupt or abstained from giving into their corruptness back then.

Look at Medicare and SS?

You could never get those passed today. They had some true bipartisan support back then. Of course, all this can't be defined or regulated. As one of my mentors said...you can't regulate integrity.

You say to yourself I want politicians with more integrity. What does that mean? How can it be defined?

I guess it is like the wind or gravity. you know it is there, but can't see the source. Same with integrity, you just know when you have it in a person, but can't define the parameters, other than the fruits of their labor that person produces.

Another fellow (I think on the AR-15 forum) had a solution America's woes. He subscribed to the "Scrooge theory."

He said if a person can't get along without pills, psychiatric care, welfare, medicare, food stamps or gov handouts then they need to just die. He wasn't bitter about it, just viewed under the law of natural selection.

I heard similar views from the survival podcast man about gov entitlements. (He didn't mention the need to die part) but, I agree with him the gov keeps a certain amount on the citizens beholden to the politicians for handouts,

But that is how we built our nation. Do we kill off half of the pop in midstream? If that was the case, America would be a very different place wouldn't it?
 

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So, you don't wish to have any national votes on controversial issues handed over to the public? You wish to keep the lying, corrupt politicians in FULL control?
Wishes are nice but there's a reality centralized authority away from the citizens is or ultimately becomes corrupt which is where we are at today. I understand what you are saying but how are you going to push through legislation when the lying, corrupt politicians you seek to get out are the ones voting, editing the legislation ? the true problem..IMO is the federal government through 200 years voted itself power and control it was never intended to have.

I agree with lots of what you said otherwise. And while the US had all these same issue in politics back in the day. The politicians were either was less corrupt or abstained from giving into their corruptness back then.
As i said before our founding father didn't have a utopian society there was lots of corrupt politicians perhaps more than today...there was allot of voter fraud in 19th century american too.

at Medicare and SS? You could never get those passed today. They had some true bipartisan support back then. Of course, all this can't be defined or regulated. As one of my mentors said...you can't regulate integrity.
Yes, lets look at Medicare and SS you think the national debt is bad at 12 trillion dollars! Medicare and SS liabilities & projected payouts exceed 100 trillion dollars and it's rife with fraud.

You say to yourself I want politicians with more integrity. What does that mean? How can it be defined?
Not exactly, i say the architects of this country had it right these where not stupid people their biggest fear wasn't foreign invaders it was the government they where creating having too much power. There's simply too much Government, too large, complex without any accountability this in turn makes it unworkable, illogical, over budget and corrupt.

Another fellow (I think on the AR-15 forum) had a solution America's woes. He subscribed to the "Scrooge theory."

He said if a person can't get along without pills, psychiatric care, welfare, medicare, food stamps or gov handouts then they need to just die. He wasn't bitter about it, just viewed under the law of natural selection.

I heard similar views from the survival podcast man about gov entitlements. (He didn't mention the need to die part) but, I agree with him the gov keeps a certain amount on the citizens beholden to the politicians for handouts,

But that is how we built our nation. Do we kill off half of the pop in midstream? If that was the case, America would be a very different place wouldn't it?
I believe that may happen regardless. This is what i'm referring to as utopian's ideology, you can have everything you want government will provide you need not worry or concern yourself...but it doesn't work! we cannot take care of the unproductive, deviant people on the backs of the productive ones..why may you ask?

social security, medicate, prescription drug liability..per citizen $347,000

Us taxpayer share of the National debt $112,000.

We are individually in the hole $459,000 dollars actually it's much more those that are unable to work or be productive like the 2.5 million US citizens in jails that the productive ones must cover. When you are done paying that we can talk about your local funding burden for schools, roads, police, fire, utilities and all other aggregate funding required of you by states and fed's

You want all theses things.. when are you going to pay for them? truth is all of us productive people don't deserve SS, Medicare, or tax cuts we can't afford it let alone the poor, sick people.

U.S. National Debt Clock : Real Time
 

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Lebanon-style politics

Unfortunately, we're going to be more aligned with gender, race, and ethnicity than political ideals in the future. Obama captured about 90% of the African-American vote. I suspect that we'll see other candidates try his game plan in the future. At some point, we'll see women back "their" candidate or a Hispanic candidate or a Asian candidate run with Obama's game plan. He or she will appeal to the majority and have a solid block of people of his or her own ethnicity.

Alternatively, we'll have lots of populist, tea-party, style candidates rise to the forefront and promise to slash government programs. Unfortunately, a lot of good government programs will probably be tossed out with the bad. And, despite the bluster, I don't see the populists getting the entitlement spending under control and the entitlements are busting us.

I'd like to see someone who is thoughtful, market-driven, principled, and pragmatic rise to power. Unfortunately, that seems like a lot to ask for these days.
 

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Maybe we should just go Starship Trooper style. Get rid of the politicians. Put the veterans in charge. You want to vote? You want rights? Or medicare? Or welfare? Serve a tour of duty. Then we'll talk.

I kind of like how Japan and Singapore had their government set up. When you turn 18, you get your choice of service for at least 2 years. Military, Police, Paramedic, etc. Doing something to serve the country.
 

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Allen,

Many other countries specify that as well - you must be part of the military when you finish high school unless you have some major problems that will not allow you to be part of the military (mental instability, physical issues that cannot be overcome... ). I also agree with you - many of the writings and ideas put forth in Starship Troopers should be implemented with-in our societies ..
 

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Heinlein was a pretty well-documented socialist, and had some fascist leanings as well.

That said, I definitely do agree with the idea that some sort of government service should be mandatory. Or at least, if you want the right to vote, you have to be in some way involved in the operation of the nation, be it military service, or governmental office work.

As for the future of American politics . . . I don't know. We are reaching a tipping point where people will begin to reach out for a option that they feel is better than what we currently have . . . I just pray that that option really is better and not just some smooth-talking dictator who is trying to grab power like Hitler did in Germany in the '30s (Or as Obama is doing now).
 

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Good bye Democracy hello Marxism! Our Marxist puppeteers will have their way soon enough. Everything that is happening in Amerika is leading us down the road to Marxism. Who's at the helm? Better get educated! I know who they are! This has happened many times before in the history of man. All the same players and the same stunts but played better due to the lessons learned in the past. Get educated people! Find out who your true enemies are. They are here, will you root them out?
 

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Politics is headed in the same downward loop you mentioned.
Until the major parties are voted out of office, nothing will change.
I am a registered Libertarian, but I would be happier with the Socialists (the real Socialists, not the Democrats, no matter how much people want to pin that name on them) in power than the current parties.
When it comes down to it, there is very little difference between the Dems and Reps. Who is to blame for our countries woes? Besides us, who continue to put these jokers in office over and over again? Both of the major parties. Both have spent us into a hole we cannot dig ourselves out of. Trying to portray themselves as different only enforces their stranglehold on the government, the economy, and the people. Its called divide and conquer.
How can a politician make an objective decision when their campaign contributions come from big business? Answer:they cant.
We almost deserve what we get for not only letting 'them' get away with it, but for putting 'them' in power in the the first place.
 
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