[theuksurvivalist]

Hi
Mine is to find a remote small holding (homestead US term i think) here in the UK and become self sufficient as much as one can. Hopefully be able to provide enough electric, own water supply, abit of livestock and crops.
The uk survivalist

 

[NaeKid]

What is the land-situation out there? I have heard some horror stories about buying places, castles, etc. Something about the queen owning everything and you are only paying rent to her and that you don't really control what you hold.

Homesteading is basically when you find raw land and you build it up to be self-sustaining. Self-sustaining means that the land pays you to be there instead of you paying to be there. If you breed and raise horses, you would sell the offspring to pay your bills. You would grow your own feed and sell off the excess each year - again - to make the land more self-sustaining. You could also build up a storage facility and people would pay rent to store their camping gear in your backyard. That rent would allow the land to pay for itself.

A non-self-sustaining situation would be where you are living in a city, in a small apartment and the apartment sucks the money out of your pocket as quickly as you can put it in.

 

[Vertigo]

Homesteading is basically when you find raw land and you build it up to be self-sustaining. Self-sustaining means that the land pays you to be there instead of you paying to be there. If you breed and raise horses, you would sell the offspring to pay your bills. You would grow your own feed and sell off the excess each year - again - to make the land more self-sustaining. You could also build up a storage facility and people would pay rent to store their camping gear in your backyard. That rent would allow the land to pay for itself.

A non-self-sustaining situation would be where you are living in a city, in a small apartment and the apartment sucks the money out of your pocket as quickly as you can put it in.

Nicely put Naekid! :congrat:

As far as my own plans, I intend to go to my parents place and bug in. It is not really rural, not really urban, but thats just how most of Belgium is. I strongly believe that for most people, bugging in (staying home) is the most viable and least cumbersome strategy. We will be able to heat ourselves, nourish ourselves, and I am working on providing energy for ourselves. Sadly the biggest thing missing here is being able to provide protection for ourselves. (unless you count the new air rifle I got ) (btw i'll give a full review of it one of these days.)

hope this helps,

V.

 

[theuksurvivalist]

Hi
There are places still that you can buy and build up but most places are all ready up and working. You are right the place will have to pay for itself. By breeding animals and selling them on. Growing crops and selling them locally.
Small holdings with property can be expensive over here for example a 4 acre small holding we are looking at is £249,000 british pounds, roughly, nearly $400,000 usd. But we have a good profit in our house when we sell it.
the uk survivalist

 

[greaseman]

future plans

I also agree that a lot of people will be staying put, and making the best of it. In my case, it's my best option. I live in a semi urban area, but surrounded by homes, and farmland. I found out recently that my neighbor behind me is also a prepper. Thank goodness for that. he told me what he is doing, and we are on the same page.

My best shot at a safe existence, is to work with my neighbors, give them food in exchange for covering my back if necessary. But unfortunately for me, my kids think I'm crazy, so guess who else will be here if it gets bad. I guess we just do what we can.

my plan "B", is to go to my wife's family's place in rural Ga. If I had enough time to bug out elsewhere, this my be a good second choice. They have plenty of food and guns, plenty hunting area, and endless fishingplaces. But getting there could be hazardous. A 5 hour trip could turn into a 16 hour fight for your life. Early action would be the key, but there are no easy simple answers to anything. Good planning is the key to the best chance of success.

 

[TreeMUPKennel]

Future plans HHHMMM, well I love were I stay except for being on the edge of a neighborhood. Got the woods to my back and real good neighbors. But my plan is to have a piece of property out in the middle of nowere were I could have a self sufficient piece of property raise everything to eat and make my own power too. Somewhere i could realy invest into my survival ways and ideas. They down fall to bugging in to me if something hits the fan and you live around town in plane view your going to stand out like a sore thumb. You know how some folks get they want what you have But if your out of site out of mind whos going to know. But that for worst case scene. They both have ups and downs to me:scratch To me being able to have family come for shelter or whatever would be key. Seeing that me a the wife both have all are families right here in the same town would be great to have property.

 

[greaseman]

Future plans HHHMMM, well I love were I stay except for being on the edge of a neighborhood. Got the woods to my back and real good neighbors. But my plan is to have a piece of property out in the middle of nowere were I could have a self sufficient piece of property raise everything to eat and make my own power too. Somewhere i could realy invest into my survival ways and ideas. They down fall to bugging in to me if something hits the fan and you live around town in plane view your going to stand out like a sore thumb. You know how some folks get they want what you have But if your out of site out of mind whos going to know. But that for worst case scene. They both have ups and downs to me:scratch To me being able to have family come for shelter or whatever would be key. Seeing that me a the wife both have all are families right here in the same town would be great to have property.

Let's face it. There are't too many good scenerios. if you bug out to the outermost boonies, sooner or later, when the towns are sacked, the hordes will come looking, as even an animal isn't stupid. When they run out of food in their homeground, they start searching. just witness the coyotes in many parts of the country. They have come into urban areas looking for food as habitat dimenishes. Humans are no different.

Many situational judgements will have to be made. The idea of situational awareness will be most important. I think even though problems will come fast, we will get warnings. If the problem is of a human nature, we'll see government forces beginning to mass in urban areas. That will be crunch time. Time to decide whether to stand and fight, or head for plan B. As hard as it is, and depending on how bad things look, for me, getting out may be the best thing. my relatives live in rural GA, about 5 hours away. There is plenty of family, food, and guns. But leaving the homestead would be tough. I don't see leaving grown children behind. I think my daughter with my grandaughter, will realize by that time that maybe all that ranting I'd done wasn't so crazy after all. her husband thinks I'm crazy, and he's one of those"that could never happen" people. Oh well, like I've said before, if I'm wrong, no problem, but if I'm right, I'll at least stand a chance.

At the present time, I see even more evidence that as a nation, we will never escape the trap that has been set for us by the elites. It is so plain, and so devious in nature, it would make a good sci-fi movie, except it's real, and it's about to take place. of that, there can be no mistake. I see more and more people waking up, and asking the same question---what if? I'm one of those that believes in a kind of collective consciousness. A type of mass sixth sense that many have, but don't realize they have it. A gut feeling best explains the concept. many people now have a gut feeling that what the government is telling us doesn't add up to what they are seeing. They are starting to ask questions, and the light bulb is coming on in their head. Time is most suredly almost out to do anything.

Let's hope this discussion board will serve as an early warning system for us. maybe that will give us a fighting chance. The plans I can see being laid by our slavemasters are a " take no prisoners" type of plan. They want us broken, obediant to orders, and begging them to save us. But their salvation is a living hell on earth. They hope millions will take the bait of government assistance, and die while waiting for help. we only have ourselves to depend on. Don't waste time. good luck.

 

[HozayBuck]

Nicely put Naekid! :congrat:

As far as my own plans, I intend to go to my parents place and bug in. It is not really rural, not really urban, but thats just how most of Belgium is. I strongly believe that for most people, bugging in (staying home) is the most viable and least cumbersome strategy. We will be able to heat ourselves, nourish ourselves, and I am working on providing energy for ourselves. Sadly the biggest thing missing here is being able to provide protection for ourselves. (unless you count the new air rifle I got ) (btw i'll give a full review of it one of these days.)

hope this helps,

V.

I have a serious question Vertigo

You live in a country known far and wide for making some of the finest weapons on the planet and you can't own them?? did I get the wrong message in your post?? I mean in this day and age I can see almost anything happening like that... hell most of the biggest anti gun senators in our congress are from Connecticut where a larg number of our sporting weapons are made...go figger...just wondered...good luck over there !! and remember !" You can always count of the French...when they need you!! opps! :ignore:

 

[CdnMtlHd]

As far as my own plans, I intend to go to my parents place and bug in. It is not really rural, not really urban, but thats just how most of Belgium is. I strongly believe that for most people, bugging in (staying home) is the most viable and least cumbersome strategy. We will be able to heat ourselves, nourish ourselves, and I am working on providing energy for ourselves. Sadly the biggest thing missing here is being able to provide protection for ourselves. (unless you count the new air rifle I got ) (btw i'll give a full review of it one of these days.)

hope this helps,

V.

When using that air rifle, will it just piss someone off if you shoot it at them or will it do some real damage? Same kind of question regarding hunting with it, will you be able to bring home the bacon?

 

[Vertigo]

I have a serious question Vertigo

You live in a country known far and wide for making some of the finest weapons on the planet and you can't own them?? did I get the wrong message in your post?? I mean in this day and age I can see almost anything happening like that... hell most of the biggest anti gun senators in our congress are from Connecticut where a larg number of our sporting weapons are made...go figger...just wondered...good luck over there !! and remember !" You can always count of the French...when they need you!! opps! :ignore:

Yeah, its a real perversion. We have been at the edge of weapon making longer than most countries exist, yet as far as owning weapons we have some of the strictest gunlaws there are. To be honest there is no one in Belgium who fully understands what all the rules are about, but I'll give a try:

As far as I understand, for every firearm you buy, you must obtain a permit, which is processed by the governor of your province (takes about 6 months). In this request for a firerarms license (it is a request, it can be denied for any reason they see fit) you must also state what you intend to use this firearm for. Once you obtain this permit, it can only be used for that one firearm, if you decide to buy another, the whole process starts again (you can however send in up to 3 (unsure, might be 5 as well) in one single request)

You are not allowed at all any firearms, 1. of an automatic kind, 2. of having a magazine over 10 rounds (exceptions for pistols), 3. of having silencers, 4. modifying the weapon in an extensive way (like shortenening the barrel and such, or installing muzzle brakes), 5. and not anything above caliber .308 (except for hunting rifles, which are usually 2-4 shot rifles). In fact, if there exists a technology to render a certain firearm with a lower round capacity, it will be obligatory.

It is not allowed to carry a weapon on your person (bodyguards can request a permit for this, but in 99% of the cases private citizens cannot). A weapon includes, 1. knives of any kind with a blade longer than about the width of your hand, 2. no pepperspray, 3. no tazers, 4. no switchblades, 5. no batons, 5. in general no concealable weapons of any sort.

There is a permit called a "sportschutterslicentie" which is roughly translated a "permit for sporting purposes" which is for double barrel shotguns (to shoot clays) and for handguns and rifles of caliber .22 or lower. This is easier to obtain however.

Apart from all this, even taking into account the conversion of dollars into euros, firearms in general cost about 2-5 times as much as in the us, with ammo, depending on the caliber (one brick of 50 rounds of .22 for about 10 dollars) to one round of .45 for about 2 dollars.

To conclude, for being one of the best firearm making countries in the world, we are in fact very much screwed. But that is the european way of life (which I do not agree with).

In fact, concerning using a firearm to defend yourself, that is a quick way to land yourself in jail for a year or 10. Even if you were fully justified.

On the other hand, I wouldn't really want the gun laws in Belgium to become much more lax all of a sudden, since 99% of the population here doesn't know how to handle them anyway.

hope this solves some of your questions,

best regards,

V.

PS: I might be off on some of the details, but I got the majority correct, it is just impossible to fully understand them correctly.

EDIT: Oh I forgot, that firearms license (apart from being registred and everything) has to be renewed every 5 years, or you need to turn your firearm in to the police. Even if it is your great grandfathers single barrel shotgun which has been unusuable for 50 years. So many firearms get destroyed by this. By the way, these licenses are not cheap, I do not know exact figures, but I have heard about 200 euros (270 dollars) each...

 

[Vertigo]

When using that air rifle, will it just piss someone off if you shoot it at them or will it do some real damage? Same kind of question regarding hunting with it, will you be able to bring home the bacon?

In most peoples' opinions (like in the US, where you have access to much better defensive options) this is a very poor rifle. However, I am pretty sure it is a very usuable rifle for hunting small game, up to rabbits. There is actually a thread I posted with some info on it:

http://www.preparedsociety.com/forum/f26/new-toy-2252/

I think it is quite usuable for (small game) hunting purposes. Just shot it las weekend, and at a distance of 20 meters (actual 20 meters, I made sure) it shot 5cm diameter groups (2 inches). Make no mistake, I am a complete newbie to shooting and have shot about 40 pellets in total so far through this rifle, so I expect to tidy these groups up much more as I get at least a bit more comfortable with it. (It does have a Bushnell scope now)

greetz,

V.

 

[TreeMUPKennel]

Let's face it. There are't too many good scenerios. if you bug out to the outermost boonies, sooner or later, when the towns are sacked, the hordes will come looking, as even an animal isn't stupid. When they run out of food in their homeground, they start searching. just witness the coyotes in many parts of the country. They have come into urban areas looking for food as habitat dimenishes. Humans are no different.

Many situational judgements will have to be made. The idea of situational awareness will be most important. I think even though problems will come fast, we will get warnings. If the problem is of a human nature, we'll see government forces beginning to mass in urban areas. That will be crunch time. Time to decide whether to stand and fight, or head for plan B. As hard as it is, and depending on how bad things look, for me, getting out may be the best thing. my relatives live in rural GA, about 5 hours away. There is plenty of family, food, and guns. But leaving the homestead would be tough. I don't see leaving grown children behind. I think my daughter with my grandaughter, will realize by that time that maybe all that ranting I'd done wasn't so crazy after all. her husband thinks I'm crazy, and he's one of those"that could never happen" people. Oh well, like I've said before, if I'm wrong, no problem, but if I'm right, I'll at least stand a chance.

At the present time, I see even more evidence that as a nation, we will never escape the trap that has been set for us by the elites. It is so plain, and so devious in nature, it would make a good sci-fi movie, except it's real, and it's about to take place. of that, there can be no mistake. I see more and more people waking up, and asking the same question---what if? I'm one of those that believes in a kind of collective consciousness. A type of mass sixth sense that many have, but don't realize they have it. A gut feeling best explains the concept. many people now have a gut feeling that what the government is telling us doesn't add up to what they are seeing. They are starting to ask questions, and the light bulb is coming on in their head. Time is most suredly almost out to do anything.

Let's hope this discussion board will serve as an early warning system for us. maybe that will give us a fighting chance. The plans I can see being laid by our slavemasters are a " take no prisoners" type of plan. They want us broken, obediant to orders, and begging them to save us. But their salvation is a living hell on earth. They hope millions will take the bait of government assistance, and die while waiting for help. we only have ourselves to depend on. Don't waste time. good luck.

Very true not to many good scenerios, but I agree with you on it. But i do feel that buging out to the out most places you can find or get too will help out alot in a SHTF situation. Me I beleave that the focus of the hordes would be caught up in the towns cities and rural areas. But I dont see them walking the across the tops of MTN's or so looking for folks hidden out. Most I think wouldnt even make it out of the cities or so. To me I see a better chance of survival tucked away hidden somewhere.
I agree to, too the government thing. Not everything adds up. My wife thinks I crazy too but I tell her its up to use to help are selfs and survive. Nobody is going to come save use.

 

[Tribal Warlord Thug]

damn......Belgium sounds like the state of Illinois......lol

 

[katfish]

My original plan was to stay put but I realized the livestock on the farm would make my family a target if people were starving. I know about half a dozen others that think like I do so with our families there would be about 18 or so of us. We're all preppin individually but also dividing up the load for a group evacuation. With us all buying a few extra garden seeds and tools that helps to ease the financial burden as well as the tactical ones such as guard duty etc. We plan on headin for the hills. Hoping most city folks will miss the forest for the trees, so to speak. I also figure its a lot like hunting on public land the more hills you are willing to hump the fewer people you are likely to see.

 

[sailaway]

Vertigo, how about a crossbow or a sling shot such as a wrist rocket. Wrist rockets have a brace against your fore arm and use surgical hose for a rubberband. Shoot automotive ball bearings from one and it is quite lethal. Both are quite silent weapons, another plus.

 

[Vertigo]

Vertigo, how about a crossbow or a sling shot such as a wrist rocket. Wrist rockets have a brace against your fore arm and use surgical hose for a rubberband. Shoot automotive ball bearings from one and it is quite lethal. Both are quite silent weapons, another plus.

Well, to be honest I do not really know how these would be regulated. I know for a fact that you can have a crossbow, they are sold here. But I do not know whether one needs a firearm permit for them or not.

Concerning the wrist rocket, same thing, only problem is I have never seen a place where I could buy one (except as a children's toy). So I do think they are not allowed to some degree over here.

A.

 

[sailaway]

Well, to be honest I do not really know how these would be regulated. I know for a fact that you can have a crossbow, they are sold here. But I do not know whether one needs a firearm permit for them or not.

Concerning the wrist rocket, same thing, only problem is I have never seen a place where I could buy one (except as a children's toy). So I do think they are not allowed to some degree over here.

A.

Vertigo, just google wrist rocket and make one. They are fairly simple. they consist of some folded up metal bar, surgical hose and cloth or leather pocket for the shot. They cost 7-8$'s around here.

 

[HozayBuck]

Vertigo, just google wrist rocket and make one. They are fairly simple. they consist of some folded up metal bar, surgical hose and cloth or leather pocket for the shot. They cost 7-8$'s around here.

Sailaway is right Vertigo, "AND" just a thought.. back in the 60's in Nam the Spook think tank and the US Special Forces were working with wrist rockets using light weight arrows ( think knitting needles) with broad heads as a small light weight silent sentry removal tool, can't say I know any more about it but I do know that.

I don't know anything about you or your situation but I'd be thinking about what's best for me and mine and to hell with the rule book, stay low, keep quiet and build your own home grown arsenal out of whatever you can.

Remember ! with a bit of guts and a sharp blade you can own a tank!! or Jeep complete with machine gun... but mostly just keep low and make no waves and be ready to grab any opportunity that presents it's self .

Of course I mean in the peaceful, legal sense....:sssh:

 

[sailaway]

Sailaway is right Vertigo, "AND" just a thought.. back in the 60's in Nam the Spook think tank and the US Special Forces were working with wrist rockets using light weight arrows ( think knitting needles) with broad heads as a small light weight silent sentry removal tool, can't say I know any more about it but I do know that.

I don't know anything about you or your situation but I'd be thinking about what's best for me and mine and to hell with the rule book, stay low, keep quiet and build your own home grown arsenal out of whatever you can.

Remember ! with a bit of guts and a sharp blade you can own a tank!! or Jeep complete with machine gun... but mostly just keep low and make no waves and be ready to grab any opportunity that presents it's self .

Of course I mean in the peaceful, legal sense....:sssh:

I concur with Hozay Buck. Sail

 

[horseman09]

Just a thought...While Vertigo is at a disadvantage because of the European anti-gun mindset regarding hardcore defensive situations, there might be WTSHTF situations where the airgun (we call them BB guns or pellet guns) could be very useful. If your only option is to double tap an unarmed but intrusive dude in the X ring with your .357 because you have no other means to send him on his way, you then have a corpse in your yard. Hmmm. Now what? On the other hand, a few rounds from your pellet gun in various body parts will hurt like crazy and probably send him packing. Not a solution for armed villans, but an option to get someone's attention without calling attention to yourself e.g. the police or N. Guard.